Interviewed for a Christmas Story in Trouw

I was interviewed, by telephone, by Mella Fuchs for the Dutch newspaper, Trouw. Incidently, that paper is a bit famous amongst Israelis as way back on March 31, 1977, it published an interview with PLO Executive Committee member Zuhayr Muhsein (see below) with a remarkable admission about the existence of a "Palestinian people".

The headline of the story is "What would Joseph and Mary's journey to Bethlehem have looked like in 2025?" with the Trouw correspondent speaking with residents along the route.

I will present my entire section and then make some comments.

"For Yisrael, it's relatively easy to travel from Nazareth to Bethlehem, he says. Unlike Palestinians (without an Israeli passport), he's allowed to cross the border between Israel and the West Bank. Entering Bethlehem itself is a different story: he needs special permission from Israel, unless he—a native American—poses as a tourist. Bethlehem is located in Area A.

Under the 1995 Oslo Accords, which were intended to lead to Palestinian self-government, the occupied West Bank was administratively divided into three zones. Area A (18 percent of the West Bank) is officially administered by the Palestinian Authority (PA). This does not mean the Israeli army remains absent; Jenin, for example, also falls under this zone. In Area B (22 percent), the PA and Israel share control. Area C (the remaining 60 percent) is entirely under Israeli authority. This division was intended as a temporary solution: power would gradually be transferred to the PA. But almost thirty years later, nothing has come of it.

The route Mary and Joseph have traveled thus far is one that Yisrael would never take. After all, it runs through Palestinian urban areas (mostly Areas A and B) in the north, around Jenin. Moreover, there are few settlements in that part of the West Bank. Settlers travel on their own roads, which are often directly connected to Israeli highways, such as Routes 55 and 5, and are (partially) prohibited to Palestinians.

Yisrael himself usually travels by hitchhiking, as he doesn't own a car. He only gets into cars with yellow license plates, avoiding green Palestinian ones. "That's the first check," he says. "The driver's accent is the second." In 2014, three hitchhiking Israeli boys in a settlement were kidnapped and killed by Hamas. "Since then, we've been very categorical," Yisrael says. "We don't get into cars that aren't driven by Jews."

According to Yisrael, the idea that settlers have their own road network is "propaganda" and that "apartheid" is a fabricated concept. But he also says he takes the bus to Jerusalem three times a week, where Palestinians are only allowed with special permits. And that he's never locked out of his settlement, while Palestinians are often confined to their towns or villages.

Yisrael doesn't find it strange that Palestinians have to pass through checkpoints constantly. "If I cross a border in Europe, I have to show my travel documents. There's no Palestinian state, but the principle is the same." Yisrael believes that the nearly 1,000 roadblocks within the West Bank are also necessary. "The army is looking for terrorists. It's not because they're trying to cause problems for people. Yes, they sometimes get stuck. But sometimes I also have to travel long distances to get somewhere."

Yisrael doesn't think it would be dangerous for Joseph and Mary to walk to the settlement where he lives. "They were Jewish, right? Then there wouldn't be any problems."

An overnight stay is likely necessary after traveling 35 kilometers from Nablus. In Shilo, there's a kosher winery, where Joseph might enjoy a glass, unless he were in solidarity with Mary. "We produce hundreds of thousands of bottles of wine a year and win gold medals in Europe," Yisrael says."

My comments:

a. "it's relatively easy to travel from Nazareth to Bethlehem, he says."

I actually said that it is not at all easy, as a Jew and an Israeli, or safe, as due to most of the route is from Jenin to Shiloh going through PA territory, I would be required to take a detour that would easily double the distance, and more, of the road length.

b. "They were Jewish, right? Then there wouldn't be any problems."

I had also said that at the time of the actual trek, the Romans were the occupiers of Judea and the family would perhaps have been feeling insecure, not to mention King Herod, the Jewish ruler, on the look out for them.

c. "Settlers travel on their own roads"

I specifically said that there are no "settler-only" roads and moreover, most of the traffic on Route 60, for example, was Arab traffic. There is no apartheid transportation phenomenon. Moreover, as noted in the article, most of the actual road kilometers in Judea & Samaria are prohibited for Israelis to travel along.

d. "The route Mary and Joseph have traveled thus far is one that Yisrael would never take."

I related to her that until the Oslo Accords of 1993, we indeed drove through much of the area. Bus 955 drove from Jerusalem to Afula (near Nazereth) straight through Ramallah and Shchem until the First Intifada [I maintain, as do the Arabs, that 1936-39 was the true first intifada] and its violence cause route changes.

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The words of Zuhayr Muhsein:

The Palestinian people does not exist. The creation of a Palestinian state is only a means for continuing our struggle against the state of Israel for our Arab unity. In reality today there is no difference between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. Only for political and tactical reasons do we speak today about the existence of a Palestinian people, since Arab national interests demand that we posit the existence of a distinct "Palestinian people" to oppose Zionism.

For tactical reasons, Jordan, which is a sovereign state with defined borders, cannot raise claims to Haifa and Jaffa, while as a Palestinian, I can undoubtedly demand Haifa, Jaffa, Beer-Sheva and Jerusalem. However, the moment we reclaim our right to all of Palestine, we will not wait even a minute to unite Palestine and Jordan.

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Linda Sarsour and Her "Jesus Was Palestinian" Routine

Have you been following Linda Sarsour's "Jesus was a Palestinian" comedy routine?

See here and here for these examples:

Jesus was Palestinian of Nazareth and is described in the Quran as being brown copper skinned with wooly hair.

Palestinian is a nationality not a religion. Your point is not negated. Jews lived with Palestinians in peaceful co-existence before there was a state of Israel.

Why so upset by the truth. Jesus was born in Bethlehem aka بيت لحم in Arabic. Bethlehem is in Palestine. It’s currently militarily occupied by Israel and home to a predominately beautiful Palestinian Christian community. Yes, the birthplace of Jesus is under military occupation.

And

Bethlehem is in PALESTINE. The erasure is repulsive.

Well, GraphicZionism responds:

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What "Palestinian" Place?

Headline:

Will Palestinian place where Jesus was baptized become World Heritage Site?

Jesus was baptized in the Land of Israel, as appears in Matthew 2

19 But when Herod died, behold, an angel of the Lord appeared in a dream to Joseph in Egypt, and said, 20 “Get up, take the Child and His mother, and go into the land of Israel; for those who sought the Child’s life are dead.” 21 So Joseph got up, took the Child and His mother, and came into the land of Israel. 

Not a country that was called "Palestine" first in 135 CE.

And there's this in Acts 13:19:

“... He overthrew seven nations in Canaan and gave their land to His people as their inheritance.”

His people were the Jews.


(h/t=RH)

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In Literary Research: Jesus and Uri-Tzvi Greenberg

From the review by Adele Reinhartz (University of Ottawa) of Neta Stahl's "Other and Brother: Jesus in the 20th-Century Jewish Literary Landscape" which, by the way, has the infamous graphic of a Uri Tzvi Greenberg poem on the cover:

"Infamous" in that an order for his arrest was issued in Warsaw causing him to flee to Berlin.

This is was Rheinhaltz writes:

Chapter 2, "Cut off from all of his Brothers, from his Blood," turns to the poetry of Uri Zvi Greenberg (1896-1981). Stahl argues that Greenberg uses the figure of Jesus to reflect his own biography and sense of self, including his experiences in the Austria-Hungarian army during World War I, the 1918 pogrom, immigration to Palestine 1923, and most important, the Holocaust. Greenberg's poetry reflects both alienation from and kinship with Jesus, who is both indifferent to and symbolic of the suffering of European Jewry. Greenberg's poetry incorporates Christian imagery not only verbally but also typographically, a point brilliantly illustrated in his poem "Uri Zvi in front of the Cross INRI" that is used to great effect on the cover of Stahl's book. In the poignant poem "God and his Gentiles," the Christian God descends from heaven, travels through Europe, laments the absence of his Jews, and is himself destined for slaughter due to his Jewish appearance. Whereas in other works the figure of Jesus is differentiated from his Christian interpretations, these poems suggest a bifurcation within the figure of Jesus himself, as both "Other" and "Brother."  This chapter provides several illustrations of Stahl's incisive and beautifully written analyses of poetry.

And from the source:

Uri Zvi Greenberg (1896–1981) was one of the most prominent figures in twentieth century Jewish poetry. In Greenberg's poetry perhaps more than in the work of any other modern Jewish writer, the figure of Jesus reflects his own personal, literary and ideological biography, and his sense of selfhood. Greenberg's characterization of Jesus is profoundly ambivalent. His poetry merges elements of rejection and aversion, rooted in traditional Judaism, with a depiction of Jesus as a character of great charm and mystery who rebels against the social and religious conventions of his time. The chapter is divided into three sections. The first section focuses on the different literary devices Greenberg uses to express the tension between Jesus' human aspect, linked to his Jewish character, and his godly aspect, connected to his idolatrous representation within the Christian Church. The second section demonstrates how this tension becomes an actual division between two personas: the Christian Jesus is referenced by the Slavic name “Yezus,” while the “authentic” Jewish Jesus is called “Yeshu.” The third section discusses the tensions between Greenberg's divergent representations of Jesus as Exilic Jew, Zionist pioneer, and even national Messiah.

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Jesus to Silverman: "That's A Good Little Jewish Girl"

Remember her cross?

Now she's in bed with Jesus:

And she's told:  

"I know where your spot is.  That's a good Jewish little girl".

P.S.  Actually, many probably didn't catch the anti-Christian dig in this clip.

Jesus never made it to 40.

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Have A Merry Festive Season

.

"Jesus was born in Bethlehem in Judea, 

during the reign of King Herod" 

- Matthew 2:1

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Was Jesus a ... "Palestinian"?

Some people claimed Jesus lived in ... "Palestine".

Hanan Ashrawi claims Jesus was a "Palestinian".

What does the New Testament say?

...an angel of the Lord appeared in a dream to Joseph in Egypt, Saying, Arise, and take the young child and his mother, and go into the land of Israel: for they are dead which sought the young child's life. And he arose, and took the young child and his mother, and came into the land of Israel.

Matthew 2:19-21


(with thanks to an anonymous commentator)

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Ashrawi's "Jesus is A Palestinian" Claim

Thanks to David Gerstman, I now have a reliable source for my memory of what Hanan Ashrawi said at the Madrid Conference I attended when I heard her speak to the media.

Whatever else Ashrawi is, one thing she is not is an expert in history. Caryle Murphy of the Washington Post wrote a fawning profile of Ashrawi, The Practiced Palestinian, in November 1991.

As spokeswoman for the Palestinian delegation at the Middle East peace conference here, the 45-year-old Ashrawi has been arguing that case with a composure, conciseness and clarity long missing in the bitter Palestinian-Israeli dispute. In the process, she has left many of the outworn cliches and taboos surrounding this conflict cut to ribbons. Take, for example, the man who rose at Friday's press conference to confront her. A representative of an American Christian broadcasting outlet, he said he "didn't understand" how Ashrawi could ask Israel "to exchange land for peace," because "when Judea and Samaria were in the hands of the Arab world, Israel was attacked three times."
"First of all, I find your reference to 'Judea and Samaria' a statement of extreme bias, and rather offensive," Ashrawi replied, homing in on his use of the biblical names for the occupied West Bank that echoes the Israeli government's religion-based claim to the land where Ashrawi lives and where the Palestinians hope someday to have an independent state. "I am a Palestinian Christian, and I know what Christianity is. I am a descendant of the first Christians in the world, and Jesus Christ was born in my country, in my land. Bethlehem is a Palestinian town. So I will not accept this one-upmanship on Christianity. Nobody has the monopoly."
After dismissing the man's challenge with a deft mini-dissertation, she ended with: "Are there any serious questions?"

How else would the areas have been referred to at the time of Jesus? I would think Judea and Samaria. (Yisrael Medad once noted that even the Christian bible uses the names. Ashrawi apparently doesn't know her own religion very well either.)

And I can add, this is how Bethlehem is geographically noted in the New Testament:

Now when Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judaea... And they said unto him, In Bethlehem of Judaea...And thou Bethlehem, in the land of Juda...   Matthew 2:1, 5-6

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Science Now Assisting New Testament Narrative

The story:

Geologists say Jesus, as described in the New Testament, was most likely crucified on Friday, April 3, in the year 33.  The latest investigation, reported in International Geology Review, focused on earthquake activity at the Dead Sea, located 13 miles from Jerusalem. The Gospel of Matthew, Chapter 27, mentions that an earthquake coincided with the crucifixion:

“And when Jesus had cried out again in a loud voice, he gave up his spirit. At that moment the curtain of the temple was torn in two from top to bottom. The earth shook, the rocks split and the tombs broke open.”

To analyze earthquake activity in the region, geologist Jefferson Williams of Supersonic Geophysical and colleagues Markus Schwab and Achim Brauer of the German Research Center for Geosciences studied three cores from the beach of the Ein Gedi Spa adjacent to the Dead Sea.

Varves, which are annual layers of deposition in the sediments, reveal that at least two major earthquakes affected the core: a widespread earthquake in 31 B.C. and a seismic event that happened sometime between the years 26 and 36.

The latter period occurred during “the years when Pontius Pilate was procurator of Judea and when the earthquake of the Gospel of Matthew is historically constrained,” Williams said.

More:

When data about the Jewish calendar and astronomical calculations are factored in, a handful of possible dates result, with Friday, April 3, 33, being the best match, according to the researchers.

In terms of the earthquake data alone, Williams and his team acknowledge that the seismic activity associated with the crucifixion could refer to “an earthquake that occurred sometime before or after the crucifixion and was in effect ‘borrowed’ by the author of the Gospel of Matthew, and a local earthquake between 26 and 36 A.D. that was sufficiently energetic to deform the sediments of Ein Gedi but not energetic enough to produce a still extant and extra-biblical historical record.”


“If the last possibility is true, this would mean that the report of an earthquake in the Gospel of Matthew is a type of allegory,” they write.

Williams is studying yet another possible natural happening associated with the crucifixion — darkness.  Three of the four canonical gospels report darkness from noon to 3 p.m. after the crucifixion. Such darkness could have been caused by a duststorm, he believes.

Would it be inappropriate to say "Jesus rocks!"?

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Some Jesus Humor

No, nothing derogatory.

It's just that if you read this article, you'll come across this theory:

if, as many Arabs and their supporters claim, that Jews didn’t really reside in "Palestine" (or, if they did, it was fleetingly and nothing was left, not even all the archaeology being found annually) and in any case, the "Palestinian Arabs" were here first as Jebusites, Canaanites and whatnot, that the history of this land is Arab, that the Temple was not located here, that Moses was a Muslim leading his people out of Egypt, and so forth and so froth, then it must be that the high priest who condemned Jesus to his death on a cross of crucifiction was also an Arab (and one who spoke Aramaic!) and those gathered in front of Pontius Pilatus’s palace, who shouted out “Crucify him, crucify him!”, were, by your logic, were none other than..."Palestinians".

Well, I am not sure that this is really funny, but who I am to judge humor.

At least we Jews aren't guilty of anything that would upset Christians.


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"He must be ostracized" - Must He?

That's from an attack on Shmuely Boteach for his new book, Kosher Jesus, based on what Haaretz (!) published to which I was alerted by listening to the latest program of Judean Eve (and here's Sybil Kaufman's interview).

Here's the news:

Chicago Shliach and educator Rabbi Yitzchok Wolf [Dean of SJ Abrams Cheder Lubavitch Hebrew Day School in Chicago] blasts Rabbi Shmuely Boteach's new book, saying the subject and recent interviews "are apikorsus."

With utter contempt I have read the title of Shmuel Boteach's new book "Kosher [Yoshke]."...Boteach's latest book is apikorsus and must be treated as such.

This book poses great danger to the thousands of unsuspecting Jews who are approached daily by Jews for J...[the book urges] embracing Yoshke as an authentic Jew, urging us to be inspired by him, G-d forbid.

...It's not the derech of Chabad to eject their fellow Jew, yet there are those rare times when it appears as an obligation to do just that...

See a follow-up there and his response here - and Klein's counter-response including "I urge you dear readers to decide if Shmueli’s embrace of his true newly found J… is part of Jewish tradition or is it the good old fashioned Christian attempt to proselytize Jews with new wrapings? [sic]".

When I was in high school, I read Joseph Klausner's books on Jesus and on Paul (and see this MA thesis).  And as I am usually adverse to long posts so let me make this point:

the theological danger, i.e., Jews converting, is one that must be combated by learning about Christianity not ignoring it.  We do have all the answers and it behooves the Rabbis and educators to instruct and teach rather than drawing a curtain.

It's as simple as that.

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The Guardian Lets Its God Down

The Guardian, which tries to be the foremost anti-Israel daily newspaper in a tough competition between the New York Times and The Independent, not to speak of the Reuters news agency, repeated yet again the false analogy:

“If Jesus were to come this year, Bethlehem would be closed'

The Arutz 7 staffer, Tzvi Ben-Gedaliah, riposted:

And what if Abraham were to visit the Temple Mount?

and explains:

The Guardian article painted a bleak picture of an “Apartheid wall” and military checkpoints that supposedly have stagnated the city of Bethlehem, located immediately south of Jerusalem. This idea was also used by anti-Israel NGO's (see NGO Monitor's "The NGO's that Stole Christmas" [by Gerald Steinberg] posted on Arutz Sheva for details.)

Yes, Abraham could not accompany Isaac on to the Mount, especially with wood and a knife.

Actually, the comparison is worse.  The reporter, Phoebe Greenwood, quoted a Father Ibrahim Shomali, a parish priest, who indicated Joseph and Mary would struggle to get into the city, let alone find a hotel room.

"If Jesus were to come this year, Bethlehem would be closed," says the priest of Bethlehem's Beit Jala parish. "He would either have to be born at a checkpoint or at the separation wall. Mary and Joseph would have needed Israeli permission – or to have been tourists.  This really is the big problem for Palestinians in Bethlehem: what will happen when they close us off completely?"

First of all, her "history" is skewed.  She includes this bit:

A strip of Israeli settlements built on 18 sq km of what was once northern Bethlehem threatens to cut the city off from its historic twin, Jerusalem.

But since Bethlehem and Jerusalem were historically Jewish (David was made king in Bethlehem and then mvoed to Jerusalem, for example), one need inquire what "history" is she refering to? Made up Arab history?

Secondly, Mary and Joseph were Jewish. On the way to Bethlehem they could have gotten shot or stabbed or, at the least, stoned by Arabs.


__________

P.S.

Honenu: Jewess Arrested for Praying on Temple Mount

A Jewish woman who went up onto the Temple Mount in Jerusalem's Old City, Monday morning, was arrested, following claims by police and Muslim Waqf authority that they noticed she was praying, according to the Honenu legal aid organization. The woman was detained for questioning by the David District police

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Jews, Judas and Jesus

Remember the "Gospel of Judas" published by the National Geographical Society last year and the debate it launched?

Well, here's an excerpt from criticism leveled by a scholar last week:-

...Judas didn’t betray Jesus. Instead, Jesus asked Judas, his most trusted and beloved disciple, to hand him over to be killed. Judas’s reward? Ascent to heaven and exaltation above the other disciples.

It was a great story. Unfortunately, after re-translating the society’s transcription of the Coptic text, I have found that the actual meaning is vastly different. While National Geographic’s translation supported the provocative interpretation of Judas as a hero, a more careful reading makes clear that Judas is not only no hero, he is a demon.

...So what does the Gospel of Judas really say? It says that Judas is a specific demon called the “Thirteenth.” In certain Gnostic traditions, this is the given name of the king of demons — an entity known as Ialdabaoth who lives in the 13th realm above the earth. Judas is his human alter ego, his undercover agent in the world. These Gnostics equated Ialdabaoth with the Hebrew Yahweh, whom they saw as a jealous and wrathful deity and an opponent of the supreme God whom Jesus came to earth to reveal.

Whoever wrote the Gospel of Judas was a harsh critic of mainstream Christianity and its rituals. Because Judas is a demon working for Ialdabaoth, the author believed, when Judas sacrifices Jesus he does so to the demons, not to the supreme God. This mocks mainstream Christians’ belief in the atoning value of Jesus’ death and in the effectiveness of the Eucharist.

...I have wondered why so many scholars and writers have been inspired by the National Geographic version of the Gospel of Judas. I think it may stem from an understandable desire to reform the relationship between Jews and Christians. Judas is a frightening character. For Christians, he is the one who had it all and yet betrayed God to his death for a few coins. For Jews, he is the man whose story was used by Christians to persecute them for centuries. Although we should continue to work toward a reconciliation of this ancient schism, manufacturing a hero Judas is not the answer.

Couinter arguments are here, if you are interested.

Of course, what all this means for we Jews is that Christians still have a long way to go before a proper comprehension of the life of Jesus and the chronicles of Christian hatred for Jews is to be set aright.