I selected this portion to highlight:
QUESTION: -- (inaudible) it’s clear...that the Administration is making a concerted effort to send a signal of the priorities and the balance, and perhaps a rebalancing. Is that enough going in? Or, eventually, does there have to be a path, a diplomatic path to Hamas, in order to resolve Gaza?...
SECRETARY CLINTON: Well, Andrea [that would be Andrea Mitchell of NBC, Mrs. Allan Greenspan],
you know, we have a very clear policy toward Hamas, and Hamas knows the conditions that have been set forth. They must renounce violence. They must recognize Israel. And they must agree to abide by prior agreements that were entered into by the Palestinian Authority.
...Hamas knows that it must stop the rocket fire into Israel. There were rockets yesterday, there were rockets this morning. And it is very difficult to ask any nation to do anything other than defend itself in the wake of that kind of consistent attack. So that’s not new news. You know what our position is. It is something that the President has set forth.
We are not able to, you know, look into the future to see whether there will be changes on the part of Hamas that would meet our conditions. But you know, certainly, that would be a clear path for them to follow.
Hillary is hinting to Hamas.
P.S. The JPost, for example, didn't pick up on this.
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21 comments:
Hamas must this and that and this and that....
How about Israel must open the boarders so that the medical supplies and food can be delivered to starving Palestinians. Or you think you didn't kill enough people yet?
Israeli members of “Let the Animals Live” (Tnu L'Chayot L'chiyot) has worked in recent days to bring food and medicine into Gaza to help animals. The aid will be used for animals in general, but particularly for those in the Gaza zoo.
The organization is working with Arab groups in Gaza and with the IDF to coordinate the aid shipments. “The collaboration between us and the Palestinians is proof that animals are not part of the political conflict... I am hoping that through the animals we will be able to draw the two sides closer together,” said Let the Animals Live spokesman Eti Altman.
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Feb/03/09
(IsraelNN.com) Humanitarian aid is continuing to flow into Hamas-controlled Gaza despite ongoing rocket attacks fired by terrorists from the region at Israeli civilians. According to IDF Major Peter Lerner, spokesman for COGAT (Coordination of Government Activities in the Territories), all the crossings into Gaza were again operating Tuesday morning, despite a Grad attack on the coastal city of Ashkelon at 7:00 a.m. Lerner said that 195 trucks are scheduled to ship goods into Gaza via the Kerem Shalom and Karni Crossings.
Arab residents of Gaza cross into Israel for medical treatment daily through the Erez Crossing. Only the Rafiah terminal, which straddles the border between Gaza and Egypt, remained closed, in accordance with Israel's determination not to open the crossing until Hamas frees kidnapped IDF soldier Gilad Shalit.
And still i hear on the news that Palestinians have to wait for hours to get gas....
"border between Gaza and Egypt, remained closed" I thought you said Israel doesn't occupy Gaza anymore :)
Silly of me, and here I thought Hamas agreed to a ceasefire (wait: boom!). No, I guess they don't.
Lies, lies and more lies, Yisrael.
Galia, as I appreciate your input and your questions - because they help me clarify my thinking and challenge me - please, when you write lies just at the least, specify one so I can understood where you think I went wrong.
"Hamas denies that it has been firing the rockets. The Gaza branch of Al Aksa Martyrs Brigades, a militia nominally affiliated with Hamas’s main rival, Fatah, has claimed responsibility for some of the launchings. Others have been claimed by smaller groups, or by no one.
In Gaza, some leaders explained the rockets as a means of testing and challenging Israel, Egypt and Hamas"
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/02/04/world/middleeast/04mideast.html
It is my understanding that Hamas is a democratically elected government of Palestinian people. As government of its people Hamas was trying over the years to resist the occupation of Gaza and West Bank. (and don't tell me that you withdrew from Gaza in 2005, if Palestinians don't have a right to freely move withing their own land and don't have a control over its own boarders!)
Israel attempts to present Hamas as not trustworthy terrorist close minded psycho lunatic etc organization that has a main aim to kill jews. That is distortion of the facts. Hamas shows many times intention to settle a peace with Israel. Only most of the times (thanks to israeli's PR war) it's not even invited to the negotiation table. Why? Are you scared that they actually will prove themselves to be different what you present them to the world to be? Why don't you let the world to decide for itself what Hamas is.
Galia, you have read the Hamas Covenant?
Just a bit:
"The Covenant of the Islamic Resistance Movement 18 August 1988
In The Name Of The Most Merciful Allah
Israel will exist and will continue to exist until Islam will obliterate it, just as it obliterated others before it" (The Martyr, Imam Hassan al-Banna, of blessed memory).
…Our struggle against the Jews is very great and very serious. It needs all sincere efforts. It is a step that inevitably should be followed by other steps.
Article Six:
The Islamic Resistance Movement is a distinguished Palestinian movement, whose allegiance is to Allah, and whose way of life is Islam. It strives to raise the banner of Allah over every inch of Palestine,
Article Seven:
As a result of the fact that those Moslems who adhere to the ways of the Islamic Resistance Movement spread all over the world, rally support for it and its stands, strive towards enhancing its struggle, the Movement is a universal one.
The Islamic Resistance Movement is one of the links in the chain of the struggle against the Zionist invaders. It goes back to 1939, to the emergence of the martyr Izz al-Din al Kissam and his brethren the fighters, members of Moslem Brotherhood. [funny, al-Qassam did in late 1935, shot dead by the British – YM] the Islamic Resistance Movement aspires to the realisation of Allah's promise, no matter how long that should take. The Prophet, Allah bless him and grant him salvation, has said:
"The Day of Judgement will not come about until Moslems fight the Jews (killing the Jews), when the Jew will hide behind stones and trees. The stones and trees will say O Moslems, O Abdulla, there is a Jew behind me, come and kill him. Only the Gharkad tree, (evidently a certain kind of tree) would not do that because it is one of the trees of the Jews." (related by al-Bukhari and Moslem)."
funny, al-Qassam died in late 1935, shot dead by the British – YM
Yes i know the Hamas covenant.
But let's look at it this way. Jews have been persecuted for thousands of years,not by Muslims, but Christians! Christians with no Hamas charter, where Bible doesn't command to kill Jews. Yet, Jews were killed in pogroms in Russia, then holocaust by hitler who wasn't Muslim either.
And the ironic part is that Jews are escaping this persecution by establishing a state among the nation that they think hates them most, which are Muslims!
I think you need to take a closer look at WHY this is happening and not who does it. Because to me it seems there always will be someone who will hate you and want to kill you.
Yesterday watched "Gandhi" once again. Do Jews believe in nonviolence as morally superior and possibly only way of successful resistance?
Galia, you're not making sense. what difference does it make who kills me? the important thing is that there are people who get live in coexistence (Hamas) whereas Israel tries to do so, more successfully or less so,
As for non-violence, it really works well only in a democracy. And between you and me, if Mubarak Awad (remember him? http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Mubarak_Awad) had really proposed NV rather than disguised sabotage, the Pals. would have been much further than they are today.
Yisrael, i think the reason i am making no sense to you is because i am suggesting that Jews need to stop! and do some serious self-examination. And you don't think you need it, you have this arrogant way of thinking of yourself as perfect ones. (that's the sense that i am getting from reading this blog and other jewish postings) I'll be honest, i feel guilty to live in the land where millions of Natives have been murdered before the country was established. I feel guilt and shame to live in a country that just recently attacked Iraq with some ficticious claims, and kills Americans and Iraqis and with that is enforcing democracy (because you can't bring democracy with weapons) . Remember Gandhi who said that he wouldn't take advantage of England going into WW2to promote its cause. I thought it was really strong. Because if you stand behind truth principle you don't have to take advantage or take shortcuts. Truth always prevails. This said, i don't understand how you can murder kids and excuse yourself for that.
The book that i recommended could be very beneficial. A little bit more spirituality can't hurt you. I really wish well for Jews and Palestinians, your destiny is too much interconnected at this time.
As for non-violence, i disagree, India wasn't considered a democracy when Gandhi started the movement, just a country of third class indigenous people, kind of what you think about Palestinian Arabs.
And when i talked about nonvilence, i meant on both sides. Recent slaughter of Gazans is an example of failure to consider nonviolence on the part of Israel. And Israel is democracy. You should apply equal standards for all, Yisrael.
I think you are mixing something up. I may appear to you to be arrogant but that is your subjective feeling, I suggest because I claim to either be right about something or you wrong about something. I try to be humble enough to be able to accept that on facts, I could be wrong and that Israel does need improvement but those matters are, unfortunately, always played out on a backdrop of what I see, historically and contemproary, as violence based on a principled unwillingness of the Arabs to admit that they may be wrong.
One example: do Jews possess a right to be politically sovereign in their own country (ignore boders, ignore other residents) - just try to reply to that.
PS I will try to be more spiritual too.
Why you refuse Palestinians the right of state?
It got to be fair. Both sides have to be satisfied only then the peace is possible.
" Given numerous chances to create a state" Based on the information I got this statment isn't accurate.
According to all statistics (which you may not trust for some reason), Israeli killed more Palestinians, than Palestinians killed Jews. Therefore your statement that you didn't come to kill, but they wanted to kill you all along, isn't consistent either.
Original Mandate? Is this the only option? If you were Palestinian would you agree to this?
You wrote:
"According to all statistics (which you may not trust for some reason), Israeli killed more Palestinians, than Palestinians killed Jews."
I'm not sure. I think the Pals. managed all by themselves to kill themselves among themselves in large numbers. In 1938-39, for example, the fighting between the Husseinis and the Nashashibis cost 2000 Pal. lives. Hussein in 1970 killed more Pals. than Israel did, probably ever. And what's going on in Gaza?
Here from year and a half ago: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p_kL2NtZR4o and now:
Sunday, February 08, 2009
23:21 Mecca time, 20:21 GMT
News Middle East
Activists seek 'Gaza abuses' probe
Rights groups say that Hamas fighters carried out extrajudicial killings during the Gaza war [File: AFP]
Human rights groups have called on Hamas officials to investigate widespread allegations of abduction, torture and the killing of Palestinians accused of being collaborators during Israel's war on Gaza.
Al Jazeera has been shown sworn affidavits, medical records and photographs of alleged victims of reprisals committed against Fatah supporters by security agents or associates of Hamas.
"I think that the officials from the Hamas deposed government have the responsibility to investigate into these incidents ... and bring those who have committed those crimes to justice," Randa Siniora of the Independent Commission for Human Rights, said on Sunday.
"There is a state of vigilantism and chaos, lawlessness in the Gaza Strip right now," she said.
"Extrajudicial killings have increased during the Israeli aggression."
In video
Hamas accused of attacks on Palestinian opponents
Separately on Sunday, the Gaza-based Palestinian Center for Human Rights called for an investigation into the death of a man beaten in the custody of security forces loyal to the Hamas movement.
Jamil Shakoura died in a Gaza hospital after receiving a number wounds to his head while detained, the group said.
He was not believed to be affiliated to any political group and it was not clear why the security forces were investigating him.
Human rights groups say that at least three people have died while in detention since Hamas seized full control of the Gaza Strip in June 2007 after pushing out security forces loyal to Mahmoud Abbas, the Palestinian president and head of Fatah.
Abuse allegations
Khalil Abu Shammala, a human rights monitor, told Al Jazeera that dozens of Fatah members were shot and tortured as Israeli forces bombarded the Gaza Strip for 22 days.
"I don't ignore that there were some mistakes made my members of Hamas, but I think that is not a policy adopted by the leadership here"
Ghazi Hamad,
Hamas official
Naem Atallah told Al Jazeera that he found the body of his son Osama, a Fatah supporter, at Gaza's Shifa hospital after he was taken away from the family home by 10 masked men.
"I asked them who are you? They answered that they are from the internal security. I asked how do I know you are from internal security and one showed me his ID card," he said.
Osama, a teacher and father of five children, had been strangled, suffered blunt force trauma to his head and been shot in the shoulder.
Another Fatah supporter, who asked to remain anonymous for fear of reprisals, said that that he had been shot in the leg three times by Hamas loyalists.
"They shot me because I am Fatah," he told Al Jazeera.
"There were 15 guys with hoods over their heads. Three of them asked me to stand against the wall and asked me my name. Three started shooting."
Hamas investigations
Hamas officials have said that they have several investigations under way into the claims of extrajudicial beatings, torture and killings.
"All our investigations are open to everyone," Ihab al-Ghusain, a spokesman for the Hamas interior ministry, told Al Jazeera.
"Nobody is allowed to kill anyone, beat anyone, arrest anyone."
However, all of Al Jazeera's attempts to arrange to view the files on the ongoing investigations went unanswered.
Relations between Hamas and Abbas's Fatah have been strained since 2007, but Ghazi Hamad, a senior Hamas official, denied that the movement's leaders are encouraging a policy of targeting rival Palestinians.
"I don't ignore that there were some mistakes made by members of Hamas, but I think that is not a policy adopted by the leadership here," he said.
"I think it's a shame for Palestinians to arrest each other or torture each other; its very shameful so we have to stop it."
Source: Al Jazeera and agencies
http://ifamericansknew.com/stats/deaths.html
Even if number of Palestinians were killed as result of inside rivalry, the gap between Israeli and Palestinians killed is tooo great.
And you didn't answer my other question. Would you agree to your proposal as Jew if you were a Palestinian? Do you think what you are offering is fair?
All's fair in love and war. So, compared to what America did to the Indians, what Russia did to Chechnya and what the Allies did to Germany, I think the Pals. got a fair deal. And if they don't agree to the territory to be divided as the original Mandate, then there's nothing to talk about. You can't have refused a half-dozen offers of compromise, kill for all and then still dmeand all. The problems is that the Arabs here still think we totally don't belong here at all.
"So, compared to what America did to the Indians, what Russia did to Chechnya and what the Allies did to Germany"
You are comparing apples and oranges. The way i see it what America did to Indians, Germans did 1941-1945 to Jews, Stalin did to Russians. What Russia did to Chechnya, Allies did to Germany.You can't compare a war with genocide.
"You can't have refused a half-dozen offers of compromise,"
Give me examples of fair offers being refused by palestinians.
"The problems is that the Arabs here still think we totally don't belong here at all."
That's not true, they will accept a fair peace proposal with 1967 boarders and Hamas has indicated that several times, but was successfully ignored.
Fair is the keyword here. Fair for both.
After Weizmann and Feisal reached an understanding, it all collapsed and the Arabs refused to recognize any specific Jewish right to live anywhere in the general area of the Land of Israel except for the Four Holy Cities and certainly not as sovereigns. The Arabs got all of TransJordan, part of Palestine, actually 75% of in 1923. But they wanted all.
The Partition of 1937, they refused and again in 1939 they refused compromise at the St. James Conference.
You are leaving out important points here. Why did the agreement b/w Weitzmann and Feisal collapsed? It's not that "they wanted all", but that they wanted independence and political rights! Just like Jews did. And it's not an unjust request isn't it? Feisal was clear on the conditions for the agreement, which were not met by British.
Then you are saying 1939 "they refused compromise". Didn't Jews reject this agreement as well, as it limited the immigration of Jews to the land.
I don't see British care for Jews or Palestinians. Do you?
The Jews had a legitimate reason to reject any compromise as they were supposed to get a state in the first place whereas the Arabs were to get, at that time, at least 7 states everywhere else in the Middle East. And they did accept the Partition of 1937!
As for the conference itself, most believe this:
The parties talked at cross-purposes:
The Jewish delegation proclaimed the need for greater aliya - Jewish immigration quotas - more Jewish settlements and the establishment of a legal defense force. The Arabs rejected the Balfour Declaration and demanded the prohibition of Jewish immigration and on land purchases by the Jews. When the Zionists found themselves at an impasse, the Colonial Secretary, MacDonald, declared that His Majesty's Government intended to relinquish the mandate and establish a Palestinian state allied to Britain.
Sources concur that the conference was, in fact, part of a calculated plan to enable Britain to present itself as an "honest broker" -- although she was in fact already committed to a conciliatory policy towards the Arabs, in face of the upcoming Second World War. Specifically, Britain knew the Arabs would reject the idea of partition -- and needed a forum to demonstrate that it was an unworkable option before officially relinquishing the option.
And yes, the British made a muck of it.
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